Posted by zaphod on November 11, 1997 at 17:27:54:
In Reply to: Re: Jesus Is a Muslim posted by Mohamed Ghounem on November 08, 1997 at 12:10:37:
In reply to the two jokers Mustafa Aslan and Mohamed Ghounem on the subject of Jesus being a Muslim. I do not believe it will achieve anything for me to discuss this subject further. Both of you appear to use the same tactics in order for you to support your claims. That is say,
1. Not directly answering my questions, by diverting the subject to another matter.
2. Accusing me of not being knowledgeable in Islam - this is based on the facts that I have presented not being familiar to them - therefore it must be I that is lacking knowledge and not them!
3. Finding items in my postings that simply are not there, i.e. I do not know about Islam since apparently I did not know Jesus was in the Koran.
4. According to them - I defame Islam, (strange, I thought we were debating) Defaming is their conclusion not mine.
5. I worship somewhere between 3 - 4 Gods, once again, their conclusion, not mine. I put it to them that Muhammad seems to be more on a par with God than that of a human since many Muslims attempt to clone themselves to Muhammad even to the point of taking the same name in such huge numbers. Who is being Idolised here? Yet Christians are accused of worshipping more than one God!
6. Scientists are athiests according to the church - I attended church for twenty years, I never heard this preached once. How many times has Ghounem and Aslan attended church and heard this I wonder? I know at least one scientist that is not an athiest and therefore this conclusion is incorrect.
7. Ghounam likes to use demographics to support that Islam is the truth. That is to say there are a huge number of Muslims -therefore they cannot be wrong, or the number of Muslims is growing, therefore Islam must be right. He conveniently forgets that population growth in Islamic countries is the highest in the world. I was born into a Christian family, but that does not make me a Christian. There are millions of Muslims that are Muslim because they were born into it with the 'label' of Muslim. This does not necessarily make them Muslims.
8. They both claim that all the errors in the Koran are false. I have read the references and NO, the errors in the Koran have not been conclusively proved incorrect.
9. Aslan asked about the 'Black Blood', - Legend has it that Muhammad as an infant was visited by an angel and his heart opened and the 'Black (evil) Blood' removed. This ceremony is practiced today in parts of Asia. I have been through this ceremony. It involves Koranic recital, a gold needle, a coconut and white cloth. By answering a series of Koran prompted questions, it can be determined which part of your body has the 'Black Blood' The area is then pierced (in my case it was the right eye) and the blood removed and place in a coconut. The coconut is then wrapped in white cloth and tossed into a river. Now, with all traces of the Black Blood removed, the subject must then drink a measured quantity of pure water. I strongly suspect that once again I will be accused of not knowing Islam (because this is unfamiliar to them) and this is an attempt to defame it. This account is the absolute truth, if anyone is attempting to defame it, it is the Muslims who performed this ceremony, not me.
10. "Only Muslims go to heaven", another ridiculous claim since the Koran itself (2.63) does not say this. Now who is it that does not know Islam!
Actually the more time I spend writing this, the more time I think I am wasting, since Ghounem and Aslan will most likely comeback with more rhetorical garbage. Lastly I would say that Ghounem need not feel pity for me. I did not ask you to, and do not wish you to. You have once again wrongly and judgmentally assumed that my family feels pity for me. How little you know, this is not the case. Let us just say that I believe Jesus was not a Muslim, and you believe he was. None of your arguments have convinced me otherwise, and I believe there is nothing further you can constructively say to convince me.
The contents of this particular debate subject can only be of interest to others reading the arguments, and they can decide for themselves.