Re: in response to Jochen

Posted by Malakh on February 16, 1998 at 17:46:24:

In Reply to: Re: in response to Jochen posted by Mohamed Ghounem on February 12, 1998 at 10:49:36:

: You are much smarter than to take part in this common Christian denial that Hagar was Abraham's wife, Ishmael was the one to be sacraficed and the only "begotten" son when
: Abraham was 99 the time of the sacrafice.

: Genesis 16:3 "And Sarai Abram's wife took Hagar her maid the Egyptian, after Abram had dwelt ten years in the land of Canaan, and gave her to her husband Abram to be his wife."

: Do you see that brother Malakh, not his hussy, not his mistress, no agreement to adopt Ishmael after he is born, simply His "Wife", I know the preacher and the commentators have been telling you otherwise for years, but they still want you to pay tithing and buy the second edition.

You can call Hagar what you like, Sarai sinned by offering another woman to her husband. Iknow the Quran and Mohummed allow for the practice of polygamy but there was no marriage contract here. Are you telling me every woman you sleep with is your wife?
(another side point here, who in their right mind would allow her husband to have another woman share her husband - that concept is just too foreign for me to comprehend - more than one woman sharing a man under the same household is just begging for
trouble in my book! ;-) I can see how Sarai and Hagar ended up at each others throats)
You see how Sarai cast Hagar out - whether concubine, mistress or 2nd wife, Sarai got the upper hand and Ishmael was reduced to illegitamate son.

: The Commentators and Preachers are not The Creator nor is their word (similar to Paul's), more trustworthy than Prophet Moses.

: To say otherwise is practically blasphmy, to say Abraham had a mistress, was committing adultry and that our Creator blessing (Genesis 17:20) an "illagetamet" child is really desparate for the commontators and Preachers to do.

: The common Christian may fall for it "We hear and we obey, here is our money" but you an obiously smart person can not fall for these insults to our forefather Abraham and labeling Allah as a poor judge.
Dont play that game with me, Mohamed, dont make assumptions and generalize about people based on what you see on TV or
read on the net ;-)

The point I am trying to make with you here is that Ishmael was no longer considered Abrahams son once he was cast out of the home of Sarah and Abraham. They were cast out
with the clothes on their backs and whatever Hagar could carry. There was no alimony offered, or meetings set up to provide for her and Ishmael.
. When youre cast out of a home, Mohamed, all ties to the family are broken. You no longer are family, you no longer exist. You are dead in
their eyes.

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Comments:
: 
: : You are much smarter than to take part in this common Christian denial that Hagar was Abraham's wife, Ishmael was the one to be sacraficed and the only "begotten" son when
: : Abraham was 99 the time of the sacrafice.

: : Genesis 16:3 "And Sarai Abram's wife took Hagar her maid the Egyptian, after Abram had dwelt ten years in the land of Canaan, and gave her to her husband Abram to be his wife."

: : Do you see that brother Malakh, not his hussy, not his mistress, no agreement to adopt Ishmael after he is born, simply His "Wife", I know the preacher and the commentators have been telling you otherwise for years, but they still want you to pay tithing and buy the second edition.

: You can call Hagar what you like, Sarai sinned by offering another woman to her husband.  Iknow the Quran and Mohummed allow for the practice of polygamy but there was no marriage contract here.  Are you telling me every woman you sleep with is your wife?
: (another side point here, who in their right mind would allow her husband to have another woman share her husband - that concept is just too foreign for me to comprehend - more than one woman sharing a man under the same household is just begging for
: trouble in my book! ;-)  I can see how Sarai and Hagar ended up at each others throats)
: You see how Sarai cast Hagar out - whether concubine, mistress or 2nd wife, Sarai got the upper hand and Ishmael was reduced to illegitamate son.

: : The Commentators and Preachers are not The Creator nor is their word (similar to Paul's), more trustworthy than Prophet Moses.

: : To say otherwise is practically blasphmy, to say Abraham had a mistress, was committing adultry and that our Creator blessing (Genesis 17:20) an "illagetamet" child is really desparate for the commontators and Preachers to do.

: : The common Christian may fall for it "We hear and we obey, here is our money" but you an obiously smart person can not fall for these insults to our forefather Abraham and labeling Allah as a poor judge.
: Dont play that game with me, Mohamed, dont make assumptions and generalize about people based on what you see on TV or
: read on the net ;-)  

: The point I am trying to make with you here is that Ishmael was no longer considered Abrahams son once he was cast out of the home of Sarah and Abraham.  They were cast out
: with the clothes on their backs and whatever Hagar could carry.  There was no alimony offered, or meetings set up to provide for her and Ishmael.   
: . When youre cast out of a home, Mohamed, all ties to the family are broken.  You no longer are family, you no longer exist. You are dead in 
: their eyes.